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Author [NL] [FR] [ES] [DE] [SE] [IT] [NO] [MY] Topic: Rear ABS works but hard to press  (Read 636 times)

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Offline Noswall

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Rear ABS works but hard to press
« on: Apr 02, 2020, 05:19 PM »
Hi Everyone. First post here so hello to you all.
I'm a new rider with almost twelve months experience now. I bought a second hand versys 650 2009 ABS as my first bike. So far so good.

Until today when my bike was in for service and MOT. I'm told the rear brake performance is below the standard to pass. They have diagnosed the ABS module as the reason, not the master cylinder or caliper. As we know the replacement cost for part 160820027 is astronomical at 1200+. Second hand ones impossible to source. I haven't ridden the bike yet (corona virus restrictions dont help) but the brake feels the same as before and is stiff to press but the brakes work and previously the ABS activated no problem and I assume still does.

So a bit of research has lead me to this old but very useful thread: https://www.versys.co.uk/index.php/topic,19271.0.html

I'm now thinking of using a reconditioning outfit to resolve the problem. However as the brake works I'm wondering what this means? Is the channel for the fluid through the module partially blocked and hence the fluid doesn't flow as easily as it should? Is this what other people have experienced is the problem? I've seen the videos about taking the unit apart and cleaning but to be honest I'm not sure I have the right tools to take this unit apart or if this will fix it.

Luckily with the MOT extension I have time to sort this but any advice very welcome.

I should also add I'm considering the rear ABS bypass. The components for a non-ABS rear brake are readily available on ebay. Just need to check with insurance about doing this. I'm due to renew insurance anyway so at least I have flexibility of changing providers if my preferred say no.


I

Offline Wal

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Re: Rear ABS works but hard to press
« Reply #1 on: Apr 02, 2020, 05:48 PM »
i'm curious how they diagnosed the ABS as opposed to the caliper/master cylinder.....if the rear wheel locks and activates the ABS (as you say) ...how can they tell  !!!

i would be tempted to fit new seals/pads/pins, clean caliper workings thoroughly and take it back and say i'd had the ABS unit checked out, the MK1's had a notoriously weak rear brake.....a spruce up may just tip it over the acceptable limit

although i don't think going to a non ABS set up is very risky, ins co may take a dim view but you could check first

Online Onslowe

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Re: Rear ABS works but hard to press
« Reply #2 on: Apr 02, 2020, 05:54 PM »
Did they actually fail the bike or just tell you it would fail after a pre MOT inspection ? If they did the test and failed it then the extension does not apply and you should not ride it until the issue is repaired and test passed. Good luck locating the problem, a good flush through will do no harm as old fluid can crystallize and block various holes in the system.
FS1E, RS100DX, GP125, MTX200, GSX550EF, CB750, TDM850, PEGASO 650, XT500, RD250B, DRZ400, VERSYS 650, W800, XSR700

Offline Noswall

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Re: Rear ABS works but hard to press
« Reply #3 on: Apr 02, 2020, 07:02 PM »
Wow thanks for the fast replies.
No the bike wasn't formally MOT'd. They advised it would fail during pre-inspection. I'm not riding it anyway due to unnecessary travel restrictions. I only ride it for fun anyway.

The brakes were flushed during the service. They even did this twice and some other checks to indicate it was the ABS unit.

Very frustratingly I was told last week (when the bike originally went in) that the brake was advisory but would pass. They suggested then maybe a new master cylinder was needed but I declined that work because they wanted to replace the whole unit not just the seals. Then the bike sat with them for over a whole week due to delays with delivery of other parts that were required for the MOT. Its strange that its gone from Ok to fail with no riding in a week.

To be honest I have had this before when the bike sat unused but I found the brake eased off with ~50 presses. I then also cleaned and re-greased the calipers as well as fitting new pads. This was four months ago or so. Its been the same ever since.

Is there a chance that old fluid has gummed up the internals of the ABS? It really does feel like I'm pushing the fluid through a restricted line. I have checked and no kinks in the lines.

Offline mac one

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Re: Rear ABS works but hard to press
« Reply #4 on: Apr 02, 2020, 11:46 PM »
Could it be that the fluid in the slave cylinder is is going past the inner seal without leaking out ? i.e. piston moves but fluid does not .Had it happen in a car years ago.

Offline 78 Bravo

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Re: Rear ABS works but hard to press
« Reply #5 on: Apr 03, 2020, 12:03 AM »
Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think that ABS activation is tested in the MOT.

Braking efficiency is tested.

On that basis, it suggests that you're not achieving an appropriate braking efficiency and, in addition, you say that the system isn't working to your satisfaction. Therefore, I would be tempted to replace the master cylinder in its entirety. It probably won't turn out to be that expensive, particularly when you compare the almost inevitable increase in insurance premium you're likely to face if you declare an ABS bypass (underwriters tend to take a very dim view of any modifications to the braking system - even good ones).
« Last Edit: Apr 03, 2020, 12:05 AM by 78 Bravo »

Offline Wal

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Re: Rear ABS works but hard to press
« Reply #6 on: Apr 03, 2020, 12:07 AM »
try another place

Offline Firstforward

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Re: Rear ABS works but hard to press
« Reply #7 on: Apr 03, 2020, 08:23 PM »
 try another place - :028: I agree with that!
« Last Edit: Apr 03, 2020, 08:24 PM by Firstforward »

Offline Siabod

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Re: Rear ABS works but hard to press
« Reply #8 on: Apr 05, 2020, 08:30 PM »
I've had this on my 2008. The rear brake pedal is very firm but doesn't activate until it travelled a long way. I expected it to fail it's MOT at a big franchise but it passed. The next year I went to a little independent and it failed. Having done all the other suggested fixes I was forced into the conclusion that it was the ABS module. Searching for a secondhand replacement was eased by learning that the same module is fitted to different bikes, BMW's etc. I sourced one for just less than 100 with a guarantee that it would work.
That was the easy bit, digging the module out of the depths of the bike takes the skills of a gynaecologist! I took advantage of the opportunity to change to braided brake lines too as if I didn't have enough to do. To cut a long story short, it worked. I now have decent brakes.
The next question is do I take advantage of the enforced lay up to do the re-valving of the front forks?

Offline whiskydave

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Re: Rear ABS works but hard to press
« Reply #9 on: Apr 05, 2020, 08:48 PM »
*Originally Posted by Siabod [+]

The next question is do I take advantage of the enforced lay up to do the re-valving of the front forks?
Don't think the lockdown will last that long.  :008: