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Offline mike5100

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Re: wind noise and hearing damage
« Reply #30 on: Aug 14, 2012, 03:11 PM »
I think wal is referring to the time I spend getting me plugs in.  The others stand around pointedly tapping their feet while I delay them for 30 seconds or so  :001:
Wal - I was thinking about that warmnsafe jacket I said you could have, and realised that you won't wear it - think of this wrapped round you, and you'll understand why. http://www.motorworks.co.uk/bmw/prodimages/lg/LUA32504.jpg
Mike

Offline mike5100

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Re: wind noise and hearing damage
« Reply #31 on: Aug 14, 2012, 03:14 PM »
*Originally Posted by Wal [+]
............ thats like saying if you partially cover your eyes you can see better :027: 
errrmmmm ... wouldn't that be them there sunglasses things then ? :001:
Mike

Offline jackh707

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Re: wind noise and hearing damage
« Reply #32 on: Aug 14, 2012, 04:29 PM »
*Originally Posted by Clunkyboy [+]

Jack is that a summary or the whole sum of 3 years Uni :008: :008: :008:
Good piece but you state the total number of bikes and scooters and that only 15% wear plugs, but how many ride over 37MPH and for prolonged periods of time. I think if you factor those in the % of people who wear plugs when its needed rises quite sharply. its suprising in this day an age when everything is so monitored in hospitals, i.e design changes are made because of injurys A&E depatments see,that there are no stats to back it up. Though do you need them after a 50mile run and ringing in your ears.
For me the helmet makers could and should do more.
Proper dependable references on anything motorcycle related are thin in the ground, and a few of my references are quite (read very) old I think your right and that more people may wear ear plugs nowadays.
And it was just a little side project compared to my normal work, don't worry ;)

*Originally Posted by mike5100 [+]
Jack - when I tried to find research on visibility of motorcyclists and accident rates I could find only one research paper published in Australia in 1996.  It's conclusions were perhaps predictable, but frightening none-the-less for those of us who choose to wear cool matt black.  The research could do with updating and validating.
Mike

There is nothing, it is amazing as i like to think we are an interesting demographic :D.

Offline TowerMan

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Re: wind noise and hearing damage
« Reply #33 on: Aug 14, 2012, 05:03 PM »
I always use ear plugs, but it amazes me how many people don't know how to fit them properly.
I have seen so many just stuffing them into the end of the earlobe - this dos not work:151:

This is how i was told to do it - especially when working in and around the grinding mills in a coal fire power station and 400kV 10,000 psi Air Blast Circuit Breakers  :goggle:


1. Roll the earplug into a tight cylinder. In order for earplugs to fit into your ear canal, you must roll the foam so that it forms a tight cylinder. This makes it easy to slide earplugs into your ear so that you get a proper fit.

2. Lift the top of your ear to open the canal. It?s impossible to insert earplugs correctly without pulling on the top of your ear. Otherwise, the canal is too closed off to reach. You will need to grab the top part of your ear and lift slowly. If opened properly, you will feel air coming into the canal.



3. Insert the earplug into the open canal. If you opened the ear canal properly, you should be able to slide the earplug in easily. If the canal isn?t open enough, you will find yourself trying to squish the earplug into place.

4. Hold earplug in place until the form expands. The foam will take a bit of time to expand. If you simply insert the earplug and then pull your hand away, the earplug will pop out. Instead, you need to gently hold the plug in place until the foam fully expands. This ensures that the earplug blocks out as much noise as possible.

5. Repeat Steps 1 ? 4. It?s important to insert one earplug at a time. Otherwise, the foam will expand before you can begin work on the second ear.

Tips
It may take a few tries before you?re able to insert earplugs properly.
If you have trouble getting the canal open, make sure to re-roll the earplug so that the foam is tight.
If earplugs don?t seem to be doing their job, even after several attempts, try buying a new brand.
Forcing earplugs into place can cause your ears to ache.
Wash your hands before you insert earplugs.
Once rolled, insert earplugs immediately or the foam will expand too much.





Richard  :001:
« Last Edit: Aug 14, 2012, 05:42 PM by TowerMan »
                          Details HERE  :123A:

Offline Throttled

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Re: wind noise and hearing damage
« Reply #34 on: Aug 14, 2012, 05:26 PM »
Unless my journey is less than 5 minutes, I wear the foam earplugs. This is a great article on noise

http://www.webbikeworld.com/motorcycle-helmets/helmet-noise.htm

and it is why I do wear earplugs now. It concludes (bear in mind it from the USA, hence the comment about wearing a helmet!)

"In our opinion, motorcycle helmets will not always reduce noise levels significantly, and, in fact, they may actually cause higher levels of noise in more harmful frequencies than might be expected.  Riding without a helmet is definitely not an answer, both for reasons of safety and because of the extreme volume of noise when riding without a helmet.  Some claim that riding without a helmet allows the rider to hear other vehicles more clearly, but this is usually not the case when riding at higher speeds without a helmet.

There are many variables that can cause helmet noise, including helmet design, motorcycle design, weather (i.e., cross winds), turbulence and also the configuration of the motorcycle's fairing or windscreen.  Some helmets are intrinsically quieter than others, either due to their design, the liner, the aerodynamics or how the helmet fits the rider's head.

We strongly suggest wearing high quality, correctly fitted earplugs whenever you ride a motorcycle.  This can help minimize the risk of hearing loss, reduce stress and make the riding experience more pleasant."
« Last Edit: Aug 14, 2012, 05:28 PM by Throttled »

Offline kernow

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Re: wind noise and hearing damage
« Reply #35 on: Aug 14, 2012, 07:52 PM »
Interesting thread , I have had a hearing loss for over 15 years now . Nothing serious but i really struggle with a conversation in a group or when there is background noise . Having done lots of miles on bikes in my younger days i do believe it has a lot to do with that as i never wore earplugs in the eighties and nineties . machine shops and noisy work condidtions iam sure haven't helped iether .

When i first began wearing earplugs i felt like Wal does and would have egreed with him about the percieved loss of senses from no hearing .
Now having used them for some time i feel its totally the opposite .Your ears are rendered ineffective from huge noise of riding screen or not .  If you get the right plugs for the riding you are doing the big confused wind noise is cancelled out and you are able to pick out noises such as a police siren much easier . At anything over 30 what else are you trying to hear while riding anyway ?  you use sight not hearing . Modern cars also cocoon you in a quiet world cut off from the outside .
 deaf people are in not classed as having any driving disability if hearing was important while driving they would be made to have some sort of badge on the car. 

Offline stevemersey

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Re: wind noise and hearing damage
« Reply #36 on: Aug 14, 2012, 08:07 PM »
Kernow, I think you have it with
Modern cars also cocoon you in a quiet world cut off from the outside .

The fact is ear plugs do not stop all noise, they reduce it to a harmless level. 

Offline whiskydave

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Re: wind noise and hearing damage
« Reply #37 on: Aug 14, 2012, 08:43 PM »
*Originally Posted by kernow [+]
Interesting thread , I have had a hearing loss for over 15 years now . Nothing serious but i really struggle with a conversation in a group or when there is background noise . Having done lots of miles on bikes in my younger days i do believe it has a lot to do with that as i never wore earplugs in the eighties and nineties . machine shops and noisy work condidtions iam sure haven't helped iether .

When i first began wearing earplugs i felt like Wal does and would have egreed with him about the percieved loss of senses from no hearing .
Now having used them for some time i feel its totally the opposite .Your ears are rendered ineffective from huge noise of riding screen or not .  If you get the right plugs for the riding you are doing the big confused wind noise is cancelled out and you are able to pick out noises such as a police siren much easier . At anything over 30 what else are you trying to hear while riding anyway ?  you use sight not hearing . Modern cars also cocoon you in a quiet world cut off from the outside .
 deaf people are in not classed as having any driving disability if hearing was important while driving they would be made to have some sort of badge on the car.
+1 Everything you say there describes me. Ear plugs to me are similar to when the seatbelt  law came in,it was strange at first but after a while it,s strange without it.When I first used ear plugs it was a bit of a nuisance but now it,s just like a ritual as putting on helmet,gloves etc.

Online Wal

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Re: wind noise and hearing damage
« Reply #38 on: Aug 14, 2012, 09:35 PM »
them there sunglasses are meant to be looked through, but i dont like wearing them either  :008: :008: out of all the motorcyclists you talk to, there are definately some with hearing loss, and lots with none, its not a given that you will suffer from it,
with no screen on my bike i'd agree, the wind noise is terrible, and it seems earplugs are the answer, but i wsnt prepared to wear them, so experimented with my helmet and screen to arrive at a situation i'm happy with obviously the faster you go the worse it gets, but mine is fine at 70-80 to the point where i don't understand why people have to wear plugs

Kernow, i tried plugs for quite a while, but i still wont wear them, dont agree that you get used to them.......... i dont think its perceived loss of hearing, it is actual loss of hearing, .it is possible to get screen noise down and helmet noise......try covering the front top vents with tape on your Xlite551, it makes a pretty quiet helmet even more so,

if you get the screen and helmet as quiet as possible ,you dont have the erplug argument as to which noises you hear, sitting in traffic or riding in urban/town situations, just make me nervous if i have ear plugs in, there is undoubtedly hearing loss, well, more than i am prepared to put up with anyway.....

we do get cocooned in modern cars, but we dont lose as much peripheral vision as we do with a full face helmet, which aggravates the problem a bit more, plus your helmet is much closer to your ears which gives a different sensation, same difference to having music in your lid or in the car, much more immediate and all encompassing in your lid

seems to me, helmet makers sell us a full face helmet, which, as soon as we put it on, gives us 30% less peripheral vision and maybe 10% hearing loss before we start, if its very noisy they say well we can sell you these earplugs which will stop the noise, unfortunately they reduce hearing by another 40%, and we say...........oooh thank you, thats progress, if you disagree, there is a furore :008:

ive lost count of the riders ive stood talking to (with helmet on) for a few minutes, then realised they were in a world of their own, and it dawns on me they are wearing earplugs.........i just dont see how that equates to being able to hear properly while riding,  ......but, thats just my take on it :002: 

Online Wal

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Re: wind noise and hearing damage
« Reply #39 on: Aug 14, 2012, 09:38 PM »
suppose if you greew up in a shoes box in the middle of the road witjh cars screeching over your head evrything else seems quiet.
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 :lostit: :lostit: :lostit: :lostit:

at the end of the day i think it is simplistic, putting something quite tightly fitting into your ear, which is designed to stop noise, cant really make you hear better, can it :027: just saying.. :002:
« Last Edit: Aug 14, 2012, 09:43 PM by Wal »